日本語識別子における複数の表現

# 戯言(ざれごと)ですよー

日本語プログラミング普及振興委員会長:中さんの影響があったかなかったか、
サンプルコードを書いておりました。

interface ♂;
interface ♀;
abstract class 人;
abstract class 男 : 人, ♂;
abstract class 女 : 人, ♀;

class 家庭 {
男お父ちゃん;
女お母ちゃん;
人[] 子供;
…
ここでハタと悩んだ。
日本語ではキホン名詞に単数/複数の区別がありません。
プログラミングにおいてはモノのカージナリティ(要素数)に
大きな意味を持ち、変数名でそれの単複が判別できると
読むのがﾄﾃｰﾓ楽。

人[] 子供s; // ないわー
人[] 子供ズ; // えーーー
人[] 子供達; // そぉねぇ...
人[] ガキども; // あ、これイイかも

日本語プログラミング推進派のミナサマ、
複数であることを識別子に含意させたいときの
命名ルールてあるんでしょか?

投稿日時 : 2009年9月17日 12:30

コメントを追加

# re: 日本語識別子における複数の表現 2009/09/17 12:42 HiJun

複数ならば、「達」でしょうか。

でも、物の場合に「達」を使うのはオカシイですし...
う～ん。日本語難しいですね。

# re: 日本語識別子における複数の表現 2009/09/17 12:48 dolan

群とかどうですかね。

# re: 日本語識別子における複数の表現 2009/09/17 12:48 επιστημη

> 物の場合に「達」

なのよ。子供だからなんとかなんだけども、
点(Point)とかどーすんのと。

点[] 点群; // どーなのよと。

# re: 日本語識別子における複数の表現 2009/09/17 12:58 biac

ら? (not 裸) f(^^;
http://dictionary.goo.ne.jp/leaf/jn/200749/m1u/%E3%82%89/
用例: 子供ら、ガキめら (w

で、人以外は、ども?
http://dictionary.goo.ne.jp/leaf/jn/141398/m1u/%E3%81%A9%E3%82%82/
「名詞に付いて、そのものが二つ以上であることを表す。」 …ってゆーけど。「名刺ども」とは言わない …いや、言うかも (意味違うけどw)

となると、やはり、タチ? (ネコとは無関係w)
http://dictionary.goo.ne.jp/leaf/jn/119814/m1u/%E3%81%9F%E3%81%A1/
無生物にも使えなくはないけど。擬人化されちゃう風味なんだよねぇ。

やはり、そのモノの種類に応じて、○○一覧 (List)・××表(Table)・△△集合(Collection) とか命名するしかないかなぁ f(^^;

# re: 日本語識別子における複数の表現 2009/09/17 13:12 επιστημη

> 一覧、表

コレらだとデータの"構造"を含意しちゃうやないですか。
列挙可能(愛えムナウらぶる)である、てことだけを含意させたいのよね。

人[] 子供集合; // ど...どーよ?
点[] 点ら; // (ﾟДﾟ)ﾊｧ?
どーも[][] どーもどもども; // ごめん無理。

# re: 日本語識別子における複数の表現 2009/09/17 13:56 Mr.T

日本語って、複数形にするときのパターンが多いし、名詞によって変化があっていいんじゃないかと。

何も複数形を統一する必要はなくて、日本語として理解が通じるところがあればよさげじゃないかなーと

# re: 日本語識別子における複数の表現 2009/09/17 14:10 επιστημη

> 何も複数形を統一する必要はなくて、日本語として
> 理解が通じるところがあればよさげじゃないかなーと

うん、それには同意します。
なんだけどぉ、日本語って相当に自由な表現が可能で、
たとえば振り仮名ひとつにしてもかなり揺れます。
# 見積もり? 見積り? 見積?
なので、ある程度の縛りを用意しとかないと
ｱｯﾁでは「子供達」ｺｯﾁでは「子供ら」と一つのモノが
異なる呼び名になりがちだろなーて思うのですわ(英語以上に)。

# re: 日本語識別子における複数の表現 2009/09/17 17:57 T.Hirase

「子供」の「供」って、初めから複数を指してません？

# re: 日本語識別子における複数の表現 2009/09/17 20:27 Ｓｏｄａ

おもむろに「々」を付けてはどうだろう。
ある意味万能で使えるような使えないような(^^;

# re: 日本語識別子における複数の表現 2009/09/17 22:27 επιστημη

> おもむろに「々」

ほほー。
点[] 点々; // ﾋﾞﾐｮｰ

# re: 日本語識別子における複数の表現 2009/09/17 23:47 まりも

以前、その辺について色々考えてみたのですが。

今は英語の識別子をつけるのに慣れているので、
単数複数が区別できて当たり前、という感覚でコードを読むのに慣れています。
この状態で、単数複数の区別が出来ない識別子を読むと、
なんだこれはだめな識別子だな、と見えてしまうわけですが。

しかしよくよく考えると、日本人は日常会話も技術的な話も、
単数複数の区別無しで特に不自由なくやっていけているわけで。
ないとどうしても情報が漏れるって事もないのではないかなと。

そう思い、単数複数の区別無しで識別子をつけることにして、
しばらくやって慣れてみたうえで、どうしても不自由なようなら考えよう、
という方針で今はやっています。

今のところの感覚としては、それで何とかなるんじゃないかな、と思っています。

なお、それでもどうしても複数だと言うことを示す必要がある場合には、
最後に「リスト」とつけています。
それだけどうしても必要な場合というのは、大体プログラム上の都合なので。
多少人工的に聞こえる単語をつけたほうが良いようです。

# re: 日本語識別子における複数の表現 2009/09/18 3:35 T.Hirase

ので、逆に単数単語に「ある」とか付けてみるとか。
「ある子」、「うえの子」、「したの子」
「ある点」、「真ん中の点」、

「点」って書くと、いっぱいの点を指すってスンポー。

「父」とか「兄」も普段は複数と思って、
「うちの父」とか「おれの兄」とか書くと
単数とか。

なんとなく日本語って複数形がベースにあるような。
ある個を指しているようで全体を指している様な感じ。
単数の場合に明示する文化なんじゃないかって。
「ちょっと男子?」を単数には言わないように。

んー。まとまってませんが、以上。

# re: 日本語識別子における複数の表現 2009/09/18 9:04 うつせみ（虚蝉）

＞人[] ガキども; // あ、これイイかも
見えなければいいんですけど。個人的にはよさげですｗ

# re: 日本語識別子における複数の表現 2009/09/18 9:05 επιστημη

> しかしよくよく考えると、日本人は日常会話も技術的な話も、
> 単数複数の区別無しで特に不自由なくやっていけているわけで。

んー...それをプログラミングにまで適用できるか疑わしいように思えるです。
ヒトの会話なり文章なりには"コンテキスト"がたっぷり含まれてて、そいつが補完してくれてんじゃないかな。
たとえば「ウチの子供が賞状もらってね」だと単数の雰囲気。"賞状もらう"って出来事が複数同時に起こると考えにくいから。
「みんな並んでー！大人はこっち。子供はこっちね」だと複数です。"並ぶ"行為が複数人を想定してるから。

で、プログラミング言語にはそんな"含意"や"ニュアンス"がﾋｼﾞｮｰに乏しい。だから"名前に含意させる"んじゃないかなーと。

# re: 日本語識別子における複数の表現 2009/09/18 10:11 biac

そうか。英語圏ではどうやってるんだろう?

Animal dog;
Animal[] dogs;

Animal sheep;
Animal[] sheep; //あ、単複同形だ。どーしよう!? f(^^;

# re: 日本語識別子における複数の表現 2009/09/18 11:14 επιστημη

単複同形の名詞はほとんど狩猟・漁労対象の生物に限られるんで...なんとかなんべ。
"猟師力学"のシミュレーションにはツラいもんがありますがー

# re: 日本語識別子における複数の表現 2009/09/18 17:41 biac

> "猟師力学"
ダレがうまいこと言えとw

# re: 日本語識別子における複数の表現 2009/09/18 21:15 まりも

>ヒトの会話なり文章なりには"コンテキスト"がたっぷり含まれてて、そいつが補完してくれてんじゃないかな。

会話に比べれば少ないかもしれませんが、クラス定義ならそれなりに情報はあると思います。
家庭クラスに子供という要素があったら、それは複数でしょう。

ただローカル変数とかだとそうはいかないですね。
foreachなんか使うと、複数と単数が必ず必要になりますし。
よく考えたらしょっちゅうあることでした。

その場合は、単数のほうに「各」をつけるようにしています。

# re: 日本語識別子における複数の表現 2009/09/21 6:32 れい

「～の配列」としています。

情報を一単語で伝える必要はないので、格変化がなくて情報が伝わらないのであれば、普通に修飾すればいいだけのはずです。

同じように「子供のリスト」とか「大人へのポインタ」とか。

私はむしろ「サ変動詞」で困ります。
メソッド名を動詞で終わらせるのに抵抗があるので(理由は略)、サ変動詞に出来る名詞の場合メソッドなのかその他のメンバーなのかわからなくて困ります。

# re: 日本語識別子における複数の表現 2016/04/07 10:25 nagamitz

すでに提案のあった、シンプルな「々」がいいと思います。しかもこれは発音しない黙字とします。(従来の「人々」などでは発音する。)
http://p.booklog.jp/book/96964/read

# re: 日本語識別子における複数の表現 2016/04/07 10:27 nagamitz

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# Write more, thats all I have to say. Literally, it seems as though you relied on the video to make your point. You obviously know what youre talking about, why waste your intelligence on just posting videos to your weblog when you could be giving us som 2022/08/10 14:09 Write more, thats all I have to say. Literally, it

Write more, thats all I have to say. Literally, it seems as though you relied on the
video to make your point. You obviously know what youre
talking about, why waste your intelligence on just posting videos to your weblog when you could be giving us something informative to read?

# Write more, thats all I have to say. Literally, it seems as though you relied on the video to make your point. You obviously know what youre talking about, why waste your intelligence on just posting videos to your weblog when you could be giving us som 2022/08/10 14:09 Write more, thats all I have to say. Literally, it

# Excellent way of explaining, and good paragraph to take information concerning my presentation focus, which i am going to convey in school. 2022/08/12 21:51 Excellent way of explaining, and good paragraph to

Excellent way of explaining, and good paragraph to take information concerning my presentation focus, which i am
going to convey in school.

# What's up to all, it's really a good for me to go to see this web site, it contains helpful Information. 2022/08/15 8:34 What's up to all, it's really a good for me to go

What's up to all, it's really a good for me
to go to see this web site, it contains helpful Information.

# What's up to all, it's really a good for me to go to see this web site, it contains helpful Information. 2022/08/15 8:35 What's up to all, it's really a good for me to go

What's up to all, it's really a good for me
to go to see this web site, it contains helpful Information.

# At this time I am going away to do my breakfast, afterward having my breakfast coming again to read additional news. 2022/08/18 19:56 At this time I am going away to do my breakfast, a

At this time I am going away to do my breakfast, afterward having
my breakfast coming again to read additional news.

# At this time I am going away to do my breakfast, afterward having my breakfast coming again to read additional news. 2022/08/18 19:57 At this time I am going away to do my breakfast, a

At this time I am going away to do my breakfast, afterward having
my breakfast coming again to read additional news.

# At this time I am going away to do my breakfast, afterward having my breakfast coming again to read additional news. 2022/08/18 19:58 At this time I am going away to do my breakfast, a

At this time I am going away to do my breakfast, afterward having
my breakfast coming again to read additional news.

# Thanks for finally writing about >日本語識別子における複数の表現 <Liked it! 2022/09/09 1:17 Thanks for finally writing about >日本語識別子における複数の

Thanks for finally writing about >日本語識別子における複数の表現
<Liked it!

# Superb post but I was wanting to know if you could write a litte more on this topic? I'd be very grateful if you could elaborate a little bit more. Thanks! 2022/11/26 18:37 Superb post but I was wanting to know if you could

Superb post but I was wanting to know if you could write a litte more on this topic?
I'd be very grateful if you could elaborate a little bit more.
Thanks!

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